B2B vs. B2C: Focusing on the right things to scale, with Laura Eigel

Laura Eigel 0:02

I would say you're probably busy working on the wrong things. Like, everybody can be busy. Like, I was super busy, and I was, like, doing all this stuff when I could have been, you know, nurturing other relationships to make an impact and scale in other companies that I'm aligned with right and so I think all of us are going to be busy it's prioritizing the right things that are going to make the right impact.

Leah Neaderthal 0:30

Welcome to the Smart Gets Paid podcast with me, Leah Neaderthal, I help women land higher paying clients in their independent consulting businesses, but I've never been a salesperson. My background is in corporate marketing, and when I started my first consulting business, I learned pretty quickly that it's about 1000 times harder to sell your own stuff than it is to sell someone else's. So I taught myself how to do it, and I created the sales approach that I now share with my clients so they can feel more comfortable in the sales process, get more of the right clients and get paid way more for every client contract. So whether your client contracts are $5,000 $100,000 or more, if you want to work with more of the clients you love, do more of the work you love, and get paid more than you ever thought you could, then you're in the right place. Let's do it together. Thanks for tuning in, and don't forget to rate, review and share you. Leah,

hey there. Leah, here, and thanks for tuning in. I hope that wherever you're listening to this, wherever you are right now, you're having a great week, making some good progress on your business and taking some time for you. So how are we all doing? Hmm, just want to sort of check in see how you're feeling, because a lot has happened since we wrapped our last episode. I mean, specifically, the election happened here in the US. And if you've been listening to this podcast for any length of time, it shouldn't surprise you that for me, it was pretty devastating, and it's the same for the women I work with. And, you know, I don't want to spend too much time talking about it here. I mean, this episode isn't about that. And if you want to read what I wrote in my newsletter, you can check it out at Smart gets paid.com/election we'll keep that up for a while. But I also couldn't like not mention it here, because it is just so all consuming, and the effects will be all consuming. And, you know, one of the things I said in my newsletter was that, you know, when things feel awful right now, we need each other. We need community. I mean, I said more than that. I mean, that's just sort of part of it, but we need community. But a lot of women consultants find that they don't really have a community of like minded business owners, you know, not one where it's like, really your people. And you know, that's what we're doing with the Academy. And actually, when I woke up on Wednesday morning after the election, one of my first thoughts was, we have to get the academy together today to just talk. And in fact, that morning, one of the members messaged me and she said, you know, for a lot of us solopreneurs, the academy is our team, and she's absolutely right. I mean, it's my team too. And so I hope in your world, you are with people who can support you right now and who will support you in the future. Because when things feel awful, it's even worse to feel alone. And of course, if you want to join our community, you can check it out online at Smart gets paid.com and we're here for you. And I was thinking about that as we were putting the finishing touches on this episode, because for the woman you're going to hear me talk to, community is really important to her as well. And I mean, not even when things are terrible, like when things are going well too, but just to be among finally, you know, women who are in the same boat in their business, rowing in the same direction as you are. And so I'm so happy to introduce you to someone who is very much in the same boat in her business, you know, as you are, and rowing in the same direction, and in fact, you'll find out why rowing in particular is so important to her. But I'm really excited to introduce you to Laura eigel. Laura is a leadership consultant and coach who works with leaders and teams to build values first cultures without sacrificing results. And when I first met Laura, she had been building her consulting business for a few years, and she realized after a while that she had been building a type of business that everybody says you should be building, but it didn't sit right. And as a result, she realized that she'd spent a lot of time moving in a direction that really wasn't right for her and for how she actually wanted to work with her clients, and how she actually wanted to solve the problems she saw with leaders and their teams. And so in our conversation, you're going to hear her talk about what she had been doing up to that point that she realized like wasn't really right for her, how she knew she needed to listen to herself, what she focused on instead, and then how it's impacted her business. And what I love about Laura is that actually, Laura decided that she was going to be on this podcast from the moment she started in the academy. I think it was like the first one on one call we ever had. She said one of my goals is to come on the podcast like I want to come on this podcast. I want to transform my business so much and get such great results that you invite me onto the podcast, and you can see she made it happen. And I love that she set such a clear goal and then worked towards it, and now in this conversation, I can't wait for her to share how she did it. So in your business, if you've ever wondered if you're focusing on the right things, or if you've been inundated with messages and ads from like every business coach under the sun telling you that you needed to do this thing or that thing or run this business. And if you've ever realized that that didn't totally feel right to you, then I know you'll get a lot from my conversation with Laura. So take a listen to my conversation with Laura eigel, and at the end, I'll come back and share a lesson that you can apply to your business, and then hopefully someday soon, you'll partner with us to help you build your consulting business, and you'll come back on the podcast and share your story. Laura, I'm so glad you're here. Thanks for being here.

Laura Eigel 6:13

Thank you so so much for having me. I have been looking forward to our conversation for weeks now, so I'm so excited that we're able to spend some time in the same space together today.

Leah Neaderthal 6:23

Yeah, well, and is it fair to say that you've been looking forward to this for a little bit longer? Because, do you remember what you said to me at the very beginning, when we first started working together? What did you Okay? I see the net well,

Laura Eigel 6:35

so I told you this. But so this is, like, my like, high achiever, like, when we start, first started working together, I really wanted to let you know that was gonna, like, do a really good job. So it was like, I'm a very good student, and I have a goal to be on this podcast. And so here I am. I'm on your podcast, and you did it. I did it, and this was one of my goals. And I will tell you, I was like, but am I ready to be on the podcast yet? I don't know if I'm ready. And you're like, Well, let's talk about it. And then you're like, Oh no, you're coming, but okay,

Unknown Speaker 7:11

I'm here. I love it.

Leah Neaderthal 7:13

You started out with, like, full confidence type A overachiever. I am going to do a great job. And then, of course, the other side of what happens to every type of overachiever is it's not, I'm not ready. It's not good enough, exactly. So

Laura Eigel 7:27

the whole, the whole spectrum that is, that is in a nutshell, me, yes,

Leah Neaderthal 7:33

that's that in you, or no, that in me sees that in you. So I that's why I'm so glad you're here, because you are ready. I'm

Laura Eigel 7:41

excited about it because also, I think it, it matches the we're never always done, and there's just so much power and like, like talking about what it's really like in the middle. Because I think we all talk about, oh, we are, at least I do. I post on LinkedIn about all the great things that I'm doing for me and my clients, but sometimes we don't also talk about the other stuff. So I'm excited to talk about all of it. Yeah.

Leah Neaderthal 8:07

Oh, me too. Well. So for the listeners, why don't you tell everyone what you do?

Laura Eigel 8:13

Sure, yeah. So I have spent my career really building the careers of leaders, of great leaders, really, and in corporate I did that as a Human Resources executive at PepsiCo, and then as the chief learning officer at YPO. And then in 2021 I transitioned, and now I am leading a company that I founded called the catch group, and I work with leaders and organizations to build values based cultures without sacrificing results. And I do that in a couple of different ways. I work individually with leaders in one on one coaching, usually when they're transitioning to new big roles at different companies, and then I help them build their team culture within that new company. In addition, now that I'm doing a lot more B to B stuff, I am now working with intact teams in strategic advising to get companies to high performing teams, especially these senior leaders. And so oftentimes there are conflicts within groups, and you need an outside facilitator to kind of help you and guide you through some of these tough, just difficult transitions as people are in and out of leadership. So I've been really enjoying doing that.

Leah Neaderthal 9:24

What was it about the catch group? I'm just curious about that name. How did you come to that? Yeah,

Laura Eigel 9:29

sure. So I am an indoor rowing fanatic, I say on my podcast. And so when I after I had kiddos, I kind of lost myself in like, all the all this, all the things, right as one does, and I am started going to this rowing, indoor rowing. It's kind of like spin class, but like all indoor rowers, and so I learned how to do that. And recently, in the last year, I started rowing. Out on the water. And in rowing, there is a part of the of the motion of rowing, like the form, like just before you push right when your oars go in the water. It's called the catch, and it's, it really symbolizes, to me, this idea that you know in rowing, it's like the same repetitive motion over and over, but once you get to the catch it's right before you push off. That's like the power that you get, and that kind of way that you can get to start over and do it again and again. That just resonated with me. And so that's the name behind the catch group.

Leah Neaderthal 10:36

Oh, I love it. I think it's so, you know, it's so indicative of probably your work and my work as well. It's like, it's about doing the same things over and over and getting better every time, right? And doing it well and getting better as a person and as a you know, in your case, a leader or what have you. You know, the catch is just a little moment, but you have to sort of land that moment or win that moment and do it better every time.

Laura Eigel 11:02

That's right, and if you mess up, you get another moment. That's what I love about it too. Is like, is that? And then, now that I'm in actually rowing on the water, one of my coaches kind of reframed it even more to me. He was like, the catch is more about like, that brief pause before you push. And so I was always thinking of it as the push. He's like, No, it's really the it's part of the recovery of the stroke. And so the that recovery and giving yourself that rest before you push again, even though it's a small rest, it's a consistent rest. So as I keep learning about rowing, I'm like, Oh, I even love this name even more. Like that's that's very important to me too, the rest, along with the achievement, right? So absolutely,

Leah Neaderthal 11:47

also, isn't it just, you know, once you once, as you're running your business and as you're working with clients, I feel like I have this always on lens of the things that are going on in my life. I'm always seeing lessons. I'm always seeing references or teachable moments or what have you. I feel like when you're an intellectually curious person and you really want to help your clients if you sort of can't turn that off. And so it sounds like this area of rowing is providing a whole new universe of metaphors,

Laura Eigel 12:20

metaphors content all of the things. Yes,

Leah Neaderthal 12:24

oh my Yeah, absolutely. Well, so let's talk about the beginning of our journey together. So you had been running your business for a couple years, few years, what was going on in the business when we started working together like you, you reached out first for a reason. What was the reason? What were the reasons? I

Laura Eigel 12:44

The reason was I found value in this podcast first and foremost. I think you found me on LinkedIn. Then I was like, Who is this and what I downloaded, like something. And I was like, Oh my gosh, this is really good. How to have not heard about this podcast before. So then I started, of course, binging the podcast, and as

Leah Neaderthal 13:03

a podcaster yourself, which you guys should check out Laura's podcast. I That means so much to me. So thank you. Thank

Laura Eigel 13:11

you. Well, I love podcasts, and you know, there's so many not great ones, and yours is a great one. And so I have learned just a ton from you, and I love your style. And so I can't remember exactly which episode it was that got me thinking, oh my goodness, I need to, I need to join this. I am a huge learner. And so one of my values is growth and development. And so I am a coach, but I also like value coaching for myself, right? And so I was in this place, this is what it looked like. It looked like this battle of B to B plus B to C. I was just so certain that I needed to crack the code on B to C, because of all of the things that Instagram tells me about how easy it is, and this person does this, and this person does that. And I don't even care if it was like the in your sleep thing, the thing that that, the that I wanted to figure out was the scalability of the impact of my work, right? And so that's what was really interesting to me about B to C and so. And at the time, I was actually in a coaching program for B to C for, like, Facebook ads and a couple other things, which is hilarious, and also it's not bad. I learned a ton of really great stuff. But I at the time, in my revenue, I was way more B to B than B to C, but I was trying, like, in my strategy for the year, I was trying to increase my B to C. That was, like, on my strategy, until I listened to one of your podcast episodes, and I was like, What am I doing? Like, this is so hard, and I was spending so much time on a Leah, I was spending so much time on it, and I couldn't figure it out. I was getting people on my email. This, that they weren't converting into these high ticket offers. I even, at one point had a $47 like, workshop or something that I was trying to sell, and I had, for really forgotten about it. I anyway, girl,

Leah Neaderthal 15:13

we have all tried that. Honestly. You know you're, you're sort of, I know you're, like, sort of chuckling at yourself, but like we I have tried it too, because you're sort of bombarded with these messages of, here's how to do it, and here's what you should do, and here's the only way, and blah, blah, blah. And, you know, nobody would be faulted for being like, Should I do that? You know? And so, yeah, I I'm saying it right here. I once had a $47 offer that I think I sold like three of them. Also little known fact, it's just as hard to get somebody to buy a $47 thing as it is to buy a much more expensive thing. Yeah,

Laura Eigel 15:51

it's it. I feel like it's probably part of, like the entrepreneur maturity model, maybe. And I like my numbers were telling me, like QuickBooks was saying, here is your breakdown of your revenue, and only a very small portion of it was B to C. So of course, the thing that I wasn't doing well, I really wanted to do well in because I I'm smart enough, I can figure this out, right? So many people are doing it well, really not that many people are doing it. And then also that wasn't like, I don't want to create another course or do another thing. I want to talk with leaders to make an impact in their work, in their jobs and their fulfillment. And so when it came down to it, I'm like, Hey, I'm actually really, really good at this, like, B to B stuff, building relationships. And so how can I kind of set up these systems that I don't have right now? And that was what was really, just really interesting about the Academy. And so I think that's kind of where I was when I reached out. I was still way more B to B than B to C at the time, but I was just spending so much of my time and like, mental energy trying to, like, crack the B to C code. I remember what episode it was, too. It was, I think it was literally that one like I heard, I think you said something like, nobody, like, you're not gonna land a multi, like, 10s of 1000s of dollars selling an $8 product. And I was like, Oh my God, of course, you're not. And so the people that I work with are in the C suite, and they make really big decisions. I used to be that person, and I work with those people now. And so that's one of the biggest things that I wanted to do. I wanted to transition kind of my mindset of like, let's stop chasing this B to C money, and let's build some really good processes to have a robust pipeline for B to B.

Leah Neaderthal 17:49

Yeah, absolutely. And you said something really interesting. You said, I've been this person. I've been this person. And I think a lot of us, you know women who are running consulting businesses, they have been that person that they are helping, right, or whose life they're trying to make better or team or organization or whatever, and a lot of us have actually been on the buying side. Oh yeah. Have you? Did you hire consultants? Or did you hire vendors in that role? I

Laura Eigel 18:17

oh yeah, I had, you know, at different points in my career I've had, I've been, you know, managing budgets of three to $5 million annually. And so I remember, you know, all those procurement processes and, you know, building those that and and really wanting to work with people that I can partner with. And so I was like, Well, I know how to do that, because I used to be on that side. So that's what I do. And most of my my B to B has come from existing relationships, right? And so what I did not want to happen was like, for that to dry out and to be like, Okay, what do I do now? And so I was kind of hoping to future proof some stuff build in just some processes that would save me some time and then get me out of this, like B to C rat race that I shouldn't really be in.

Leah Neaderthal 19:10

Yeah, it's, it's a very different, very different, I was gonna say it's a very different game, but it's a whole different universe, you know? And right? I mean, for all the reasons that you described, I'm curious though, you know, so you've managed budgets, you've brought on consultants, you've brought on vendors, and you know, I did as well, right in my corporate life. But how did that translate so like, so when you're the buyer, it's you know, you you don't totally know everything that goes on, as when you are the seller, right? And so, how was it different, if at all, like when you started actually trying to sell your services into these companies. I mean, how did it feel different? Or what did you discover? Yeah,

Laura Eigel 19:57

for me, this is where imposter syndrome. Just kind of took over, and it felt very personal, and I had this running tape in my mind that, like, I'm not good at selling. I really thought that, like, I'm not good at that, but you know what I am good at? I'm really good at relationship building. And so when I thought about that in terms of, I'm not I'm not selling, I'm connecting, I'm I'm helping leaders transition. I'm sometimes the just creating spaces that bring them more confidence, right? And so when I I had to switch that kind of, that mindset, but, but it's very easy, though, to to slip back in the Okay, I have to write a proposal, and is it? And I just question myself all the time. Being on the selling side, it felt, I don't know it's I wanted to do it in an authentic way. And I had seen so many people do it icky, especially in like, the B to C piece to I mean, I don't know how many like, it was interesting when you're on the when you're on the in the corporate side, I would get like, a bajillion emails on LinkedIn, DMS, like, you know, obviously trying to get business. And you kind of have the power, because you're the employer and you're like, you know, you you have that B to B money to spend whatever. And now on the on the other side is different. Now I get like, coaches for coaches for coaches, like in the ICMS, which I like, hate. So I didn't want to be that, I didn't want to be that, I wanted to feel like authentic, I wanted to build relationships. But those take longer, right? It's not been as steady, right? It's like, some months I might make $100,000 some months I might make five, like, that's just how sometimes they pay you and so, or you get, you receive payment. But like, for me, it was, how do I get more consistency? And really it was, I needed more people in my pipeline. And so I needed, I didn't feel like, like, I didn't want to cold call anybody I didn't want to DM anybody I wanted to learn. Like, how do I do this in a way that is authentic to me, and that's still bringing value to all these people that I care about and I want to help. And so those are some of the processes that I've learned and have actually saved me time, and I think about it in a lot of in a different way. Now, after the academy, it's more I used to come from a it felt like scarcity from that seller point of view, like that imposter syndrome is scarcity. Now it feels more like abundance, like I have control over, like what is in my pipeline, because I have now built a pipeline in it process because of the academy, and I did not have that before.

Leah Neaderthal 22:41

Yeah. Well, okay, well, let's talk about, let's talk about, sort of, you know, you wanted to build up the B to B business and really focus there, and, you know, turn off all the things that are not focused on, the things that weren't working right. You wanted process. You wanted consistency. Let's talk about where things are now, and then we'll sort of fill in. How did we get there? So how are things now relative to that? I mean, what's, what's changed for the better? Yeah,

Laura Eigel 23:07

the biggest things is I'm working on I'm working on different things, which I love, and I wasn't sure, like I saw I wanted it, but I wasn't sure how to get there. And so well, we can talk about how to get there. But now, what it looks like. I am selling in certifications, leader certifications, through my framework called values, first leader, which is really exciting. So I'm selling that into B to B. I'm also selling in team sessions. So I've been spending a lot of my time with senior teams and using my frameworks within that which has been just so fun to see that come to fruition. And I'm working on my second book, which is called values first teams, which is all around like the topic of teams, where I want the work to come and do more of that work. And that has been centered around the use of my framework because of the work of the academy. The other step that I'm doing, I'm I'm also teaching clients how to get sponsored within their companies. So they might come to me as a B to C person, like they might come to me and say, Hey, Laura, I need and I said, and I will, and I will teach them how to, how to get it sponsored from their companies, which is exciting too for them as well, to get sponsored for their development. And it's, it's, it's really fun to be, to be more centered in the kind of work that you want, and to get paid for it. And I, and I wasn't really sure how it was going to happen, and one of the ways that it, it has happened is, you know, through some of the processes too. So the other thing that looks very different is I use a CRM now, and it's not all. It used to all be in spreadsheets and in my head now, and now it's, yeah, and now it's not. And that's exciting, because. I have one kind of source of truth, and I found the CRM through somebody in the academy who really liked it. So I was like, Okay, I'll try it and just see. And it's been working really well for me, and super low cost. But the process behind it, like today, my day, was looking at my pipeline, doing the follow ups, and, like, updating my CRM and, like, a year ago, I wouldn't have been doing that, and well, and, and I wouldn't have been doing it in the B to B pipeline, right? I would have been like, chasing, you know, B to C people or something. And then I think the other biggest thing in terms of process has also been proposals that I was taking forever, and I was like, I don't know, I would just iterate and iterate on them and spend too much time. And that's completely been revamped. I've gotten, like, so much time back through that process, through the academy too. So I'd say the content of the work, in addition to kind of building some things out for my framework, and then the processes with the CRM pipeline and proposals have probably been the biggest changes from like this year from last year.

Leah Neaderthal 26:10

Oh my gosh. Well, how does that? How does that impact the rest of the business? Or how, you know, how does that impact you is in the business? Yeah,

Laura Eigel 26:18

it feels really good to be working on the things I want to work on, like that. It created, it created more time for family. So I'm a mom of two boys. I'm a wife. So I've been married to my husband for this year. Will be in a couple of months, will be 15 years. We just got back from a vacation for spring break, and I counted how many days so far this year, Leah, that we've taken vacation. Um, I've been on vacation for more than two weeks already this year. Like, it's like

Speaker 1 26:48

18 days, and it's early in the it's very early in the year. It's the q1 is not over

Laura Eigel 26:53

yet. So, um, so that that's freedom. Um, just working. Yeah, more time with family is a big deal. I also start my days differently now, because I'm not kind of fanatically running around, and so that's been a change this year. I can I teach about how to build boundaries and those kinds of things, and I've I'm usually pretty good at doubling down this year because of some of the processes that I put in place like I'm not I block my calendar. I don't start really until 10 with meetings, which is great, because it kind of gives me the ease of the morning to, like, go to a doctor's appointment, do my walks, go rowing, like all these kinds of things, be with the kids. So that time freedom is a big deal too. And the way that you have reframed kind of the energies and the freedoms, like financial freedom, time freedom, what's the other freedom?

Leah Neaderthal 27:48

Well, there's, there's financial profitability, professional profitability and emotional profitability. That is right? Financial being, the money part, right? Professional being, doing the work that you love, with clients you enjoy, and then emotional being. You know, do you have time for the things that matter to you? And are you optimistic about the future?

Laura Eigel 28:06

Yeah, so for all of those three, first and foremost, that shift of thinking it that way, because I am to your point of like, perfectionist, high achiever, I am very privileged, because my we're dual house, dual working household. So my husband works in corporate, and so I've always had that stability right to help. But I, because I'm out on my own, I put a ton of pressure on myself. I do, and I want to make sure that I maintain so i i joined last year, and I had, I was doing pretty well, and so I for financial profitability, I have increased 20% higher than last year, which is exciting. And then professional profitability, I'm doing more of the work that I want to do in the way that I want to do it with the clients that I want to work with, right? Which is amazing. And then, I mean, just like, the time that I get to spend with, with the people that I want to spend it with, but like, that's, that was the whole dream of all of this. And so the other thing I've been able to do, I've hired a part time person as well to get me even out of other things that I don't like to do as much, like some of the posting, like, I still write it, but they post it and so, so that's been really great as well. So growing in lots of different ways. Yeah, well,

Leah Neaderthal 29:32

I think also just hearing the way you're describing, like the work now. I mean, when you were talking even just a few minutes ago about what it was like to sort of chase after these B to C clients. And you know that whole grind, when I hear you talking about the work now, your face is different. It's like your whole, you know, affect is different. And so just to hear you that you're doing the work that you love in the way you want to do it, and you're making great money, and you're taking, like, all this vacation and having time, you know, having you. Relaxed mornings, like, that's, that's it, you know, that's the balance. You don't, you don't, sort of, in this framework that we have with the emotional, profitability, professional profitability, financial. It's not like you win all of them, right? It's like you get into balance. That's, that's the goal. And it sounds like, you know, it's you are finding, or you have found that balance,

Laura Eigel 30:21

and it's and it's, let me figure out other things that I want to do. And so a couple of years ago, I started teaching one class at the University, and I was like, Oh, this is cool. And so then now I'm taking a bigger role, and I'm the program director for Ambassadors Program, also in Organizational Psychology, and that's fun, too. And I would never be able to do that and do all of this at the same time if I didn't have that right? I'm not gonna say, I'm not gonna say work life balance, because that's not a thing, but I think it, it's not a thing, and that is a false perfection, but it allows me to do the things that I that are fulfilling, and I get to model that for my kids, I get to model that for my students. And it's, it's exciting, and it's exciting to know that I'm gonna figure out how to scale that, and that's even more fulfilling. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 31:14

well,

Leah Neaderthal 31:16

you said something that I want to just sort of touch on, because you were talking about, I want to take my framework, or I'm teaching according to my framework, or this book is based on my framework, or whatever, and I want to bring it up, because what I find about people like you or I, or you know, some of the women who are listening is sometimes we are like our overachieving brain tries to protect us by finding reasons why it won't work for us, or we can't do it, or whatever. And so when I hear you say framework, and I mean, of course, we have a whole training on the academy on how to create your framework or whatever, but I can hear some people being like, well, that might work for her because she has a framework, but I don't have a framework. What would you say to somebody who's sort of grasping at that as they listen to you? I

Laura Eigel 32:08

didn't have a framework until I named my framework. And you have, everybody has a framework because you have a way that you do things. It's a sequence of work, and I just named it something cool, right? And so I am, I had, I will be honest, I had a framework coming into the academy, but I wasn't using it in the same in the way that I'm using it now. So let me tell you about how that's changed. So coming into the academy, I had written my first book already, called values first, which is basically my coaching framework. So it's called the values first framework has different steps. It has the acronym values. And I coach people on how to find their values, audit them, build life boundaries, uplift others while doing so, how to get through conflict and then how to sustain it. So all of that I was using within individuals, and I was trying to figure out, how do I use this in other ways? And so the framework, training with the academy, and thinking of how I want to utilize this, not just for individuals, but within intact teams, it was like, this big aha. And I just remember you saying, make it so. And I was like, wait a minute, what? And you were like, make it so, like, and I was like, wait a minute, I can just do something. And it was just this huge light bulb moment where I was like, Oh, well, you know, every, like, literally, every certification is from a company or some organized organizing body of people. That was somebody's idea, and then they just did it. And so that's what I'm doing. I'm using my existing framework, and now I've built a certification that I have, like a cool badge on LinkedIn that's authenticated, and I have a system behind it that I'm selling into organizations like I did that because I can, I can do that because anybody can do that. Because everything like great places to work, or whatever, is a company that made a decision to do a thing, and guess what, I'm a company, and I'm going to make a decision to do a thing too. And so now I'm doing that, and I'm also using my framework with the second book, I'm building out values first teams, which is the same framework, but for teams. So anyone was like, it's like, Aha, like, Duh, of course. And guess what? Then there'll be values first organizations. And so it's this three tier methodology with a framework they already had and and it's and it's not reinventing the wheel, but it's kind of just spinning it a bit, and it's the work that I really want to do. And I remember, like there was a leader that reached out to me that said, Hey, I'm doing this off site. I'm trying to figure out the agenda, and I need a facilitator. So we were talking through it, and I was like. Like, Oh my gosh, I'm going to use my framework for teams in this, because I'm going to make it so and this is, this is now the framework that I use, and that's what I did. And it was amazing, and it felt so good, and it was very well received and and it was all because I made it so

Speaker 2 35:17

well. I love this. And you know this phrase, make it so that you're, you know, bringing up. So this is something, if you might be hearing this for the first time, if you're listening to this episode, but make it so is something we talk about a lot in the academy, because, and it comes from Star Trek. There's a whole story behind it, Captain Jean Luc Picard, but you know what it means in in real life, is

Leah Neaderthal 35:39

make it so, right, like, just whatever, you don't have to ask permission. You don't have to, you know, weigh pros and cons and model it out, or whatever, whatever you want to do, you can actually do it. And nobody knows that you didn't have that two years ago or two months ago or 20 minutes ago, and because you are the driver in your business. And so you can make it so, so taking a framework that you already had and saying, I can apply this to teams and make these, you know, adjustments so that teams can get benefit from it. I'm going to do that. I'm just going to do it. But also, I think you said something, it was, was really, really key, which is, you sort of the Royal you, right? You have a way of doing things. And I think a lot of women don't believe that they they think, Well, this is just what I did in my career. It's just what I know how to do. And they haven't, you know, they don't believe that they have a framework or a process or and by the way, a framework is not step one, step two, step three, necessarily. It's what you know to be necessary for this problem to be solved. And so I just, you know, we all have that. I mean, what would you say to somebody who's like, well, I don't know. I don't have a framework.

Laura Eigel 36:55

You know, it comes up a lot because so I coach high achieving women too that are transitioning in their careers. And so it's it comes up in that as well there, and they ask questions like, well, doesn't everybody do it that way? Or that seems really easy, like this. It's too like, I'm good at that. It's easy. Surely, that's not the answer. But guess what? Like, it's not easy for everybody. It isn't and you are really good at that thing because of who you are in your experience, you may not realize that you already have a framework, just like you don't realize that, you know, not everybody can build a strategy that quickly, or not everybody can do whatever your expertise is that quickly. If it's easy to you, it's probably a framework.

Leah Neaderthal 37:40

I love that, if it's easy to you, it's probably a framework. And I just love that in relation to, you know, as opposed to, it's easy for me, it must not be that big of a deal,

Speaker 1 37:51

and that it is a big deal. It is a big deal, probably a

Leah Neaderthal 37:55

framework. Oh, I love that. That's going on a post it.

Laura Eigel 37:58

I love it. It's like, I think the things that we think like as women, I think if we if it's easy for us, we assume that everybody else can do it, and that is actually not the case. And guess what? Not everybody thinks that way. I wish we could, you know, borrow some of that confidence from some of our friends that have a little too much of it sometimes. But if it is easy for you, that's probably the indicator that that's your thing.

Leah Neaderthal 38:23

I love it. Ah, so good. So I'm curious, what would you say to somebody who's in the position that you were, you know, back then, let's rewind like a year, right? Who maybe had been chasing B to C and wanted to do more B to B, or who needed process, or who needed consistency? Like, what advice would you give that woman?

Laura Eigel 38:44

Yeah, I would, I would say, to invest in yourself. Because I think you say it often. It's like, invest now, not when like you need it, like when it's desperate, right? Because this idea of I'm a continuous learner, right? And so I see I know that I do not know everything, and other people have done it before me, and they have probably figured it out faster. And so how can I learn? Learn from somebody who's done it already? And so investing in yourself and trying to figure that out is only going to help you and do it sooner rather than later, like I was in the point of my business, like I would, I would have been fine, but I would have done a lot of things and spent money in different places that I wouldn't have needed to. I will tell you I wouldn't have taken this many vacation days. And to start before you think you're ready, is something that I tell my own coaching clients to I think the people that that know that they are worth to an invest that in themselves, right? Like it's not just an investment in your business. I really think it's a it's a holistic investment in myself. I. Um, I will tell you, I still feel bad because I don't use all of the things that the academy gives me, like, I really don't. And I'm like, Oh my gosh, I need to spend more time, but it has met my needs, like, more over the other thing I would say too, is, like, I just the caliber of people in there. This is also the biggest difference between B to C and B to B, this community that you have built. Leah, oh, my goodness, like, and I've been in, I can't even tell you how many of these, like B to C entrepreneurship communities where everybody's, like, literally just starting, and they're selling stuff to each other and drives new bananas. And here it's, everybody is, like, they're rock stars, they're all experts in whatever field they were in in corporate before, and they're just genuinely amazing humans. And I just feel such like in a place of trust, like there's a place where I can get feedback on proposals, like I just stick my whole proposal there, and then people give me feedback, like, what that's so cool, like, like, that's and that's the thing that I needed. I needed a place to feel safe and just cheered on. And it's just been a everybody's just so smart and just just so good at what they do, and all of us do different things. Yeah, it's

Leah Neaderthal 41:25

and it's also nice to be in a place, thank you for saying that. And it's nice to be in a place where people are not selling stuff to each other. Oh, God, I cannot with that. It's, yeah, coaches who coach, coaches, who coach, coaches who just want to coach you on whatever thing they coach on. It's

Laura Eigel 41:40

so icky, right? It's so icky. So I've, I've been in too many like Facebook groups that are like all of that and or selling like products. Most people, most of the folks in ours, are like service based consultants. They're all consultants.

Leah Neaderthal 41:58

They're all consultants. Yeah, all services, right? Yeah. And

Laura Eigel 42:01

so it's, it's almost like, you know, you're, you're, you really aren't alone. You're, you're not. If you need somebody, I could, I could jump on that slack channel right now and just say, hey, is somebody around that can jump on a call with me? And they would,

Leah Neaderthal 42:16

yeah. They really, yeah. It's a wonder. Thank you for saying that. It's such a it's my favorite place on the internet. You said something that I just want to touch on, which is you're not just, how did you say it? It's like you're not just learning a thing, even though you are a lifelong learner, but you have to. Maybe I don't want to put words in your mouth, but it's like you're learning to become a person, like you change as a person. It's not just like you're learning a bunch of processes. Can you speak to that? I mean, how? How do you think you are different?

Laura Eigel 42:46

I'm I'm thinking more about time on the business versus the work that I'm doing. I'll give you an example, like earlier today. I had a block of time that was literally in my pipeline, I would not have had that a year ago, like, like, dedicated time to work on my pipeline, and I knew exactly what I needed to do. Because, so for me, I have to be, I have to have systems and processes, because otherwise, I'll get, you know, like, there's so many things I could be doing, right? So, and so I've been able to put structure into that day to really work on the things that are going to move the needle to get to the impactful work that I want, right? Yeah. And so I learned that process, which isn't, it was not hard, but it took a little bit, just a little bit of time to set up once I figured out how to do it, always, it's always the case, right? Like you, you dread thinking about, Oh, I need to figure out a process. And then when you actually do it, you're like, oh, that took an hour and a half. Like, it didn't take long at

Leah Neaderthal 43:54

all. Why did I think about that for 11 months when it could have taken an hour and a half?

Laura Eigel 44:00

Yeah. And so that's changed me into thinking more strategically about the business, like working on the business, instead of just work working on client work as well. I mean, obviously there's always client work, and I love that, but it clears my mind to be work on that client work in a different place. Then, okay, oh, I have this, I have this, I have this. I have all these things to follow up on now I have, like, a time that I do that, and a system and a process, and that is, that's another kind of freedom that I don't think I had last year either.

Leah Neaderthal 44:33

Yeah, I love positioning. That is freedom. Because one thing that you hear from, or I hear from women who are busy, right? Because when you came, when we started working together, you were busy, like, you had stuff going on, you had clients, you had all these things. And I hear a lot of like, well, I can't work on this now because I'm busy. So how would you respond? I mean, what would you say to somebody who said that as

Laura Eigel 44:56

well? Yeah, I would say you're probably busy working on the wrong things. Like, I everybody can be busy, like, I was super busy, and I was, like, doing all this stuff when I could have been, you know, nurturing other relationships to make an impact and scale in other companies that I'm aligned with, right and so I think all of us are going to be busy. It's prioritizing the right things that are going to make the right impact. I didn't know what those things were. I thought I did. I was chasing the wrong things. I was following a path for something that I thought I could do and would like scale in a way, and I was scaling in the wrong way. And so, like, we're really smart, but we don't always know, because we're at the beginning. Of our journeys even a couple of years in. I plan to be doing this for a very long time. I am not at any point going to ever go back into corporate, like, that's just not the life that I want anymore. And so I want to do this for the long haul, and I think investing in figuring out what those right things are at that point in my business, we're going to be crucial for that. Yeah,

Leah Neaderthal 46:05

I always, and you're so right. I mean, this is what I tell I'm like, we're always going to be busy, even our we will. We, even if we're not busy, we will find ways to be busy. And you know, I always say, like, if you're if you're not busy, learning the solutions, you will definitely find time to suffer from the problems. And so absolutely, you know, this is when you're busy. It's actually the best time to do it.

Laura Eigel 46:30

Oh, yeah. And, and I realized, Oh, these are the tasks that are not valuable. Let's stop doing those. And here are the tasks that are valuable, and let's prioritize those more. So,

Leah Neaderthal 46:43

you know, I talked to a lot of women who are, you know, for a number of reasons, focusing on a lot of different things in their business. So fill in the fill in the blank. For me, I almost didn't work with you because

Laura Eigel 46:57

I almost didn't work with you because I was too busy. And do you remember I almost joined, like, this other coaching group. I was like, I don't know if I don't have time to do both. And you were like, well, what is that going to get you? And when do you have to make the decision and, like, the thing? And I still haven't done that, and I don't need to, and I'm so glad I didn't do it, and I'm so glad I prioritized the right one.

Leah Neaderthal 47:19

Yeah, I do talk to a lot of women who are like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna do a program that's more around, like, my area of expertise, like more skills in my area of expertise.

Laura Eigel 47:29

It's, it's so interesting because it's like, I see this also with the women that are, like, high achievers. It's like, should I get a master's degree, or should I get a certification? Or should I become a deep knowledge expert? And like, you're already an expert, like they're not giving themselves credit where credit is due, like you have years of that you don't need even more, it's not going to get you anything. And sometimes it's it's scary to think about, like, I don't know everything about this whole entrepreneurship thing. We need to increase our business acumen. We need to increase our business development acumen, and I needed to prioritize that more, and that's why I joined. So I think we always think, like, I'm super smart. Can figure it out right? Like I did with B to C, and it's like, well, that's not the right thing to go figure out. Go figure out the right thing. And that's, that's exactly, that's exactly what it is. And you give a road map on how to do that based on where you are in your business. And it, you know, there's tools that are already there, like, I didn't have to build any of that stuff. Like, there's examples, there's libraries, I will tell you I have seen as a learning and development professional executive for decades. There are so many, there's such there's so much content, and a lot of it is not good. I have seen a ton Lydia, and I will tell you that your content is amazing and it is searchable, and you can find it, and you'd like you listen to feedback, and you've made it all this bite sized content that, like I can actually do and not spend three hours on and implement very quickly. And then I get feedback, and then I get reminders to do it, and it's it's good, it's good learn. It's great learning journey stuff. And I would tell I'm kind of a learning professional development snob, because I've just seen so much and so it's good stuff.

Leah Neaderthal 49:28

Thank you. That means so much. Thank you so much. And yes, as a as somebody who is also a lifelong learner, I too have bought lots of courses, tried to do lots of courses, and all I wanted was something of a universe in which people were could learn, wanted to learn, and could be successful and could do and did that. So thank you so much for saying that. Laura, where can people find you? You

Laura Eigel 49:55

can find me on LinkedIn. That's where I spend most of my time. You can. Also find me on my podcast called you belong in the C suite, and then you can find the book where you buy books. It's called values first, how knowing your core beliefs can get you the life and career you want.

Leah Neaderthal 50:11

Awesome, Laura, thank you so much for being here.

Laura Eigel 50:14

Thank you so much for having me. I have loved this conversation, and I've just loved getting to know you and just thank you for everything that you do. And also I'm just glad that, like we fulfilled this goal of mine, because you know goal achievement. God love that

Leah Neaderthal 50:30

I know star, you get a star on your turn.

Oh my God. What a great conversation with Laura. And if anything Laura said spoke to you or helped you, I hope you'll reach out to her and thank her. And there are so many good nuggets here and so much goodness that you can learn from and actually, you know, you might have missed it, but something that Laura said really sparked something for me too. Again, you might have missed it. It was so fast, but she mentioned that she's coaching leaders on how to get the company to pay for her coaching. Did you catch that in the conversation, she's coaching leaders on how to get the company to foot the bill, which is genius. And after our conversation, I kept thinking about it, and I was like, you know, that's something that any consultant who does coaching should know how to do, and actually, really any consultant who does any service, because when you sell B to B, you do actually have to get the work sold in and get the company to pay for it. So I asked her if she would do a session for our members on how to help your clients get their company to pay for your work. And she did, and it was awesome and so helpful. So if you're in the academy, you can find that session in the portal. So thank you so much Laura for doing that. So even though there's so much good stuff that Laura shared in our conversation, I wanted to pull out one lesson that you can apply to your business, and it's this idea of going either B to B or B to C, and what's the right business for you. Because I talk to women sometimes who have been having a hard time getting consulting clients, or maybe they've been told that they're too expensive, or it just feels like too much of an uphill battle to get a yes. And they'll tell me, you know, they'll say, like, maybe I'll just make a course, the assumption being that having a course will be easier to sell, right? And that's where I'm like, screaming on the inside, I'm like, Oh, girl, you have no idea creating a course or some sort of low ticket, you know, B to C product creating it is easy, marketing and selling that B to C thing. I mean, that is harder than your wildest dreams. And I think it really comes down to, like, what is the business that's right for you? You know, how do you want to solve the problem that you see in the world, and how do you want to work with your clients? Because running a B to C business usually spend less time doing the work, and you spend a lot more time marketing your business. And running a B to B business, you spend less time marketing it, and more time doing the work. And here's the honest truth. You know, running a, b to c, low ticket business isn't easier than working B to B. It's just different. And I would argue that having done consulting and coaching and courses in the span of the businesses I've run the B to C like course, business model is actually the hardest because, you know, you can sell 150 $1,000 project, or you can try to sell 100 $500 courses. And as anyone who's tried it knows, it's just as hard to sell a low dollar thing than it is to sell a high dollar thing. But here's the good news in all of this, there is an inflection point where businesses or business owners go from I want to learn how to do a thing to I want someone to do it for me. Before the inflection point, they want to learn how to do something, and after they pass that inflection point, they want someone to do it for them. And that inflection point, at least in my experience, is somewhere around $500,000 to $750,000 maybe, you know, a million dollars or so after that they want to pay someone to do it, to solve the problem. And you might notice that that number is actually like, pretty low in the, you know, world of business. And most businesses are above that, like well above that. So what we can take from that is, if businesses are your clients, they don't want to learn how to do a thing, they don't want a course. That's not how they want to solve the problem. They want someone to come in and do it for them, and they will pay for that, which is perfect, because so many women consultants I work with. Tell me, you know, I just want to do great work, right? Like, how many of us feel more comfortable behind the scenes, just doing the work, right? And so when you think about how you want to work with your clients and how clients want to work with you, there's a ton of overlap, like that. Venn diagram is like a. Circle, basically. So listen to that, and listen to yourself, and give yourself permission to build the business that you want and work with clients in a way that you want, because then you'll be able to not just build the business you want, you'll be building the life that you want and the future you want. You

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