When you find yourself at a crossroads: consulting or full-time job?

Leah Neaderthal 0:02

We talked about how, like, in the past couple of months, you've sort of been more visible, or I remember, I forgot exactly how you phrased it, but it was always almost like you wished that you had, like, kept up with people more, right, people from your past. So essentially, one of the things I would recommend is do the things now that you wish you had done before.

Welcome to the smart gets paid podcast with me. Leah neaderthal, I help women land higher paying clients in their independent consulting businesses, but I've never been a salesperson. My background is in corporate marketing, and when I started my first consulting business, I learned pretty quickly that it's about 1000 times harder to sell your own stuff than it is to sell someone else's. So I taught myself how to do it, and I created the sales approach that I now share with my clients so they can feel more comfortable in the sales process, get more of the right clients and get paid way more for every client contract. So whether your client contracts are $5,000 $100,000 or more. If you want to work with more of the clients you love, do more of the work you love, and get paid more than you ever thought you could, then you're in the right place. Let's do it together. Thanks for tuning in, and don't forget to rate, review and share.

Hey there, Leah here, and thanks for tuning in. I hope that wherever you're listening to this, wherever you are right now, you're having a good week, making some good progress on your business and taking some time for you. So this episode is going to be a little different. So most of the time, I guess nearly all the time, on this podcast on LinkedIn, in my work with the clients in the academy, I'm talking about how to be successful in your consulting business. You know how to get more of the clients you want, how to get paid more, all of that. But today we're actually not talking about that, because in this episode, I'm talking to someone who decided that running a consulting business isn't the right thing for her right now, and she took a full time job. She made that decision because of some really important reasons, and you're going to hear her, you know, talk about them in our conversation. And you know what? I was really happy for her, because it was absolutely the right thing for her right now.

And when she brought that to me, the conversation then became what you're going to hear. It's about how the things that she was learning with me, about how to build her consulting business, how she could use those skills in her new role. Because here's the thing, even though I'm all about helping you succeed in your consulting business, even if you go in a different direction, I want to give you the tools you need to be successful, and the skills and strategies that help you grow your consulting business are so valuable in other areas of your life and in other areas of your career. So this isn't something we talk about a lot, you know, getting a job, but it is important, because as you're going to hear and as I'm going to share at the end, we each have to make the decisions that are right for us, and when we make those decisions, we need the support of those we care about. So in this conversation, you're going to hear why my client decided to take a full time job, how she can still nurture her relationships, even while she's working for somebody else, and the specific things she can do right now to prepare her to go back into her business when she's ready. So I want to send a huge thank you to my client for allowing me to share this conversation with you. Take a listen, and at the end, I'll come back and share a lesson that you can apply to your business.

So yeah, what would be the best possible outcome for you of this call?

Speaker 1 3:37

Well, we had a really long call, actually our first call. So I feel like it's a little bit different. We kind of went through a lot of my biggest issues. We covered a lot. I feel like it's more just like a check in maybe, and just, you know, okay, I have something to share with you. I've got some news, and I don't know how often this happens to other people in your course, I feel like we have such weird timing. Sometimes it's good news. So I got an offer to go back to agency world. So I know, I know it's crazy, and I would never go back just for whatever. You know, it happens to be an agency where came in, and they are just amazing, and they're trying to build this super diverse team. And between you and me, I don't want to do this long term, you know, like, I just need some health insurance, to be honest with you. I get that on my own, and, like, my partner's between jobs, and I just, I have all these things I need to do with my health and so I was like, Well, what if I can provide a lot of value to them, you know, over the next 12 months, get my medical stuff in order, and then kind of do my thing.

Speaker 1 4:51

I still, I feel like, obviously, I'm still in this and still want to learn. But I'm wondering if, like, yeah, I don't know. I feel like this could apply to stuff that I do there. In terms of, you know, being able to close things or, you know, to prospect, but I also feel like I'm gonna have to pick up my own business, because this is my long term goal, is to be independent. But I just wanted to share that with you. Yeah, it's a big change, and I haven't been in agency world for like, five years, and there's even a couple of projects now. Speaking of breakup letters, it's so funny. I've been trying. I've been writing a couple and you're right, as soon as you're like, I kind of have to go for a little bit. People are like, no, don't leave me. I was like, I should have done this earlier. Like, that one guy who just wasn't was ghosting me and was literally taking four months to schedule. As soon as I'm like, yo, I'm actually headed out the door, he's like, Oh my god. Can we do it this weekend, you know? And I'm like, I've been asking you for four months to do our power hour thing, right? You know, as soon as you're like, Well, I gotta go now, they're like, holy shit. But yeah, that's just the big news. And I feel like that's all well, and I just, first of all, never happens to you. I don't know.

Leah Neaderthal 6:00

Well, first of all, you know, congratulations. My first reaction notwithstanding, you know, you and I have talked about how, how we feel about the agency world having Yes, it's both come from that. Yeah, but health insurance is no joke, and especially if you're going to work for an agency that's sort of being reimagined by people who are? Are you people?

Speaker 1 6:22

I will say this, because I know you and I have talked about this, and what I wanted to achieve with my consulting career was how to do my work remotely. That was the big thing. And when you and I talked, I remember I got a lot of value because you were like, you just need to tell people that this is how it is, like, you know, and that everyone else is going to accept it. Because I was just so scared to tell people, like, hey, I need to work remotely. Is that okay? And you're like, No, you just need to say, like, this is so like, how I do it? And that's what I had started doing. And it's crazy, because when Corona happened, it's like, now everyone's remote, and I feel like it just, you know, I would never get a chance to do this. So basically they were like, you have to move to so I was like, and again, trying to be confident. I was like, Can I get 12 months to kind of work from? And they were like, Okay, sure. So I feel like personal victory. So I think instead of being like, Oh my God, what's going to happen after 12 months, I think I'll just not worry about the future, like my therapist says, like, just, let's do what we need to do. But half my role is kind of what I do now, but a lot of it is also gonna be new business, of course, right? Which is a lot of this stuff as well, right? Which is just knowing how to get a yes, all of that stuff. I do feel a little rusty on that because, well, I don't know if I should be like I've been selling myself for five years and my own right, and I sold myself into them, you know. So when they're just like, all right, new business, new business, new business, I'm like, All right, that's the name of the game, totally. And

Leah Neaderthal 7:52

I think you're gonna have so many more tools. Biz Dev is where I started, at DDB, I and then at Leo Burnett. But biz dev for an agency is very different than selling consulting services. Consulting Services, yeah, yeah. However, there's a lot that you can apply. You know, you've learned about value based messaging and how to position yourself and the agency, not just as what you'll do, but the way that you will transform a business, right, or a brand? Yeah, you've talked you've learned about leading the client and really leading a sales process. You, I don't know to what degree you'll be able to influence pricing or all of that, but you can certainly lend some for sure. Oh my gosh. So So I think what trips a lot of women up, and I think you experienced this. You shared this with me too. It's like selling yourself is hard because it's so personal, people feel a lot more comfortable selling somebody else, right? You know, with it, with you have a name behind you, yeah? And so you're going to be able to do the biz dev free from that heaviness. That's right, yeah. You have more tools, and you're not going to be worried about, like, will they like me?

Speaker 1 9:06

So interesting, that is, I guess what? I'm like, I'm thinking a little bit also into the future, about, again, I know agency world. You know, even got advice with people from really close friends before I took the job. They were like, Girl, you're going back into the field. Like, I was like, I know it's not a lot, but what I'd love to do after I leave there is, yeah, come back to my own thing. But I'm wondering if I can make it a little bigger. I don't know yet. I just feel like, what's the next evolution of it? Because I've been doing that thing where it's just me, but I think it's really interesting now how it's like, Oh, I'm just a strategist, but I know I could get more business if I partnered with, I don't know, a coder or, like, you know, yeah, it also makes the website or something like that,

Leah Neaderthal 9:50

Yeah. I think the vision can be a lot bigger. And what really happens is people stop hiding. They stop being sort of quiet. Quietly awesome, as one of my clients says, and they start being, like, visibly awesome, and people notice, and some people notice and want to hire them for consulting or coaching or whatever, and some people notice and want to give them a job. And so it hasn't happened in a long time, but I remember, I mean, I can think of a couple people, yeah, years

Speaker 1 10:20

i think that's exactly what you mean. And, yeah, I never planned it, but I was just like, uh, I just think even one year doing this is going to really help, especially

Leah Neaderthal 10:30

with the year that you've had, yes, prior to this. Oh my gosh, girl, get that health insurance. Yeah. So what can I? Can I offer maybe a few things that, in addition to sort of what you're learning in the course, and you'll apply to your biz dev,

Speaker 1 10:46

and it's been so helpful, for sure, yeah, oh,

Leah Neaderthal 10:49

I'm so glad. Yeah. So, you know, we talked about how, like, in the past couple of months, you've sort of been more visible, or, I remember, I forgot exactly how you phrased it, but it was always almost like you wished that you had, like, kept up with people more, right, people from your past. So essentially, one of the things I would recommend is do the things now that you wish you had done before. Yeah, you know, you know, send out an email that said to everybody you know, that says, hey, I'm so excited. I'm joining this team. Yeah, talk about your your company's successes. Talk about your successes publicly on LinkedIn, where you know in the channels that make sense, almost like, think about it. It's like, if you're laying the groundwork for the next thing, that groundwork starts now with the benefit of you're actually not selling anything right now.

Speaker 1 11:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think the last time we talked, we talked about how I was five years ago, but I continue to get a lot of my consulting referrals from them. So now I wonder if even this year is going to build the foundation. Like, if I do a kick ass job there, I'm like, I'm filling the hopper back up for my pipeline, right? It's like, if I just, like, kill it, and everyone loves me. And then if I go, it's like, great. It was like, What did for me five years ago

Leah Neaderthal 12:13

exactly. So you're essentially priming the pump. So that, when you think about it, like, when you leave this job, yeah, you will not, you won't be starting at zero.

Speaker 1 12:22

Yes, yeah,

Leah Neaderthal 12:24

right. So that's, that's the first thing I want you to do. The second thing I want you to do is start a brag book. All right, brag book is a Google Doc or note, or wherever you keep your notes of the awesome things that you are doing in this job. And I would actually go back and say, what are the things I did for my clients? Because what ends up happening is all these things that you do, and you know, these, like little wins and or big successes, you sort of forget about them. So, so it's the kind of thing where this would be helpful if you wanted to get another job, because also you could talk about your wins at the previous job. But you know, as it relates to your consulting, tell small stories, almost like make many anecdotal case studies about what you're doing and what you have done, and so you have a place to look at your successes. And that becomes anecdotes that you can bring into sales, conversations, to proposals. You know, that becomes the stuff that it's like, Yes, I can do this.

Speaker 1 13:32

I love that brag book. I have a little email folder called kudos. That's more when people say nice things, but I feel like this is put them together, my kudos list on a brag book,

Leah Neaderthal 13:46

yeah, but in the kudos I love that, because my My thing is called nice things, nice

Speaker 1 13:52

label, a label and Gmail, that's called nice things,

Leah Neaderthal 13:56

you know, just I would honestly put something on the Your calendar that, like, the last Friday of the month. Okay, what happened? What happened this month? Yep, that I can put in here. I

Speaker 1 14:06

know we totally gloss over it and, like, just, and it just disappears,

Leah Neaderthal 14:11

right? And then, you know, if you're looking for a job, or if you are going out to get new clients, it's, you know, all of a sudden you're, like, paralyzed being like, Oh, wait, what did I even do?

Speaker 1 14:21

Yeah, I know it's crazy, because, of course, as soon as you're like, Yes, I'll take this job. I just feel like so many people have come out of the woodwork because I've gotten all these shout outs on LinkedIn. Like a couple of women were like, these are the best strategists. And talk about like a lead generator. When someone makes a list and they're just like, here's 10 women who are amazing. All of a sudden, my inbox is full of all these people I've never met. And they're like, I saw you on that list. There's a billion projects to work on it. I'm like, Ah,

Speaker 1 14:49

the timing, the timing. So I just wonder

Speaker 1 14:53

how I can, like, I do think this will be good and it'll just make me a stronger independent consultant when that's a. Over as well. I think, you know, just being able to say, great, I've got some other achievements under my belt. But, yeah, I'm curious. I just feel like people are still gonna keep contacting me for the next year, yeah, just wondering what I do. Like, I was just like, maybe I start a newsletter. Like, I don't know. I was trying to get creative. Who knows? I totally

Leah Neaderthal 15:18

would, yeah, totally would try to get as many people into your orbit, you know, connect with people, collect people on LinkedIn, because now these are going to be the right people. I would never advocate that you just collect randoms, but collect the right people. Yeah, you know, say I'd love to stay in touch and then put them on your reconnect list.

Speaker 1 15:37

Yeah, warm, right? I

Leah Neaderthal 15:40

need to keep them absolutely. You know, every every quarter say, you know what's going on, what's new in your world. This is sort of what we've been working on. If these are the people that we're hiring for, because, again, you're not selling anything. So it's almost like less pressure, yeah, but keep them, keep them warm, the same way that, you know, we're talking about keeping the people that you already know warm, right, so that you don't look back the next time and be like, Oh, I wish. I wish I could have. I wish I should have, or I totally should have, you know, stayed in touch.

Speaker 1 16:15

Yeah, yeah. So I think it's really exciting. Thank you. Thank you. And, yeah, I'm excited to still go through, you know, the rest of the course I'm determined to finish. I was like, Oh my gosh, we're gonna finish. I just feel like, to me, it's like an evergreen course. It's something that you can return to every year and probably learn something different from it, because I'm gonna be in a different context every time I look at it.

Leah Neaderthal 16:40

Well listen, I will see you in like, a couple hours. Yes, and I'm very excited for this new development.

Speaker 1 16:48

Aww thank you so much. Yeah, yeah. I think it'll be really helpful. Thanks for just always being on my journey.

Leah Neaderthal 16:57

All right, so I want to pull out a lesson that you can apply to your business and to your life, and it's this idea of the season of life, and that you make the decisions that are right for you for the season of life that you're in. I first heard this term season of life when I spoke to Mandy Ellison, the founder of the hands off CEO, when she did a training for our Academy members about how to grow your business without maxing out your bandwidth. And in that training, she told the story about how when her kids were young, she realized that it just wasn't the time to build the big business that she wanted to and she scaled it back to a business that was really successful but manageable for her at that time. And she said, You have to build the business for the season of life that you're in. And that phrase really stuck with me. And I think about it a lot, and I find that it's really helpful as a frame for where to focus, and it really helps me take the pressure off for like, all the things I want to be doing, like, right now.

So perfect example. One of my life's goals is to do an Ironman Triathlon. And if you're not familiar with it. And Iron Man is a triathlon consisting of a 2.4 mile swim, a 112 mile bike ride and a 26.2 mile run. So yeah, you heard that right? The last part is like a full marathon. It's a huge goal and a huge accomplishment. And even though I did a couple triathlons several years ago, it's like way, way, way beyond that. And training for an Ironman is like a part time job in itself, like at least 20 hours a week, four months on end. And even though this is a goal that I think about a lot, and I want to do it so badly, I also have two small children, and so doing an Ironman isn't right for the season of life I'm in right now. And this idea of the season of life, it's a great way to think about your business, too, and creating a business that fits the season of your life.

For example, one of my clients is putting her foot on the gas pedal in her business because she's been at the same level for a while, and she wants to break through this revenue ceiling. I have another client who, you know, after spending years traveling to client sites, wants to get more clients locally so that she can spend more time with her kids. One of my other clients is thinking about retirement and structuring her business so she only does the thing she wants because she said she's just too old to deal with the stuff she doesn't want to do, and having a business that'll allow her to take long vacations. And finally, another one of my clients wants to simply get paid more and make more money with no other extenuating circumstances, just for no other reason at all. She just wants to, and that's okay. I mean, we love that. And then, as you heard, one of my other clients decided that consulting wasn't right now, and she accepted a full time job.

And I also love this idea of this season of your life, because it's a great reminder that nothing is forever like me doing an Ironman. It doesn't mean I'm never gonna do it. It just means I'm not doing it right now. Same thing with things in your business, you know, whatever you want to do that maybe you're not doing. And maybe you're sort of like feeling bad about yourself for it. It doesn't mean that you'll never do it. It just means now might not be the time, and when you get to another season, maybe that will be the right time. Because, listen, I'm not trying to force people into anything. I'm there for whatever their journey looks like. You know, I'm not the type of coach that'll tell you, like, the only way to consider yourself successful is to make, like, $1,000,000.07 figures, whatever, because the flip side of that, and the whole, you know, this is the only way you have to make seven figures. Thing is that, like, if you don't drive to do that, or if you don't want to drive to do that, then it makes you feel like you're not successful. And that's a shitty feeling, especially for women like us who are ambitious or overachievers and who want to do the best we can instead, I want to help you create the business and the life what we call your 3x vision that's right for you, and give you the tools to do that. It's not about my definition of success. It's about yours.

And I think one beautiful outcome of that, for my clients and for me is that it creates a space where people can bring what's really going on in their life, and we can have an honest conversation that's productive without fear and without shame, because I feel like, yes, we are running our businesses and working with clients and building wealth and around that and within that, life is happening. Our life is happening, and sometimes life looks messy, and we can't ignore how that affects us as people and also as business owners. It's one of the reasons why we offer family leave in the academy where you can pause your payments for two months and let you take care of the people in your world or yourself without worrying about, quote, unquote, falling behind in the program, and so you can get some payment relief. So you have to make the choices that are right for you and make the right choices for the season of life that you're in, even if you end up getting a full time job because you decide that consulting isn't possible for you right now or isn't the best fit for you right now, the skills and strategies that will help you build your consulting business, those skills are still a game changer for your career and a game changer for your life. You.

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